every martyr in this jungle

Well, you know where this is going, right? Militant friendslocking in the sharing of such media. *sigh* I feel so stupid, I should've known that with the kind of demand there is for these recordings someone would do something like this, and it makes me sad and livid at the same time that it's happening.

From:

icebun.livejournal.com

::nodding::

I'm feeling livid on your behalf.

::hugs::

From:

chenin.livejournal.com

Can't you report the individual to Ebay? Yes, it's technically an illegal recording so some may say you can't be upset about someone else taking it, but the fact that it's illegal could be grounds for Ebay to yank the auction. You don't even have to say you recorded it, just report it. Just a thought.

From:

It's not through eBay. I'm not going to name names, and there's nothing that's legal about any of it in the first place, ergo nothing much to be done. I'm not being "But they're mine!" about this, that was never why I recorded or shared it. I'm just disgusted that this is something I did for the community that's now being unfairly and without permission capitalized on.

From:

chenin.livejournal.com

It's not through eBay.
When you mentioned Ebay I just assumed that's where it was being sold. Oh, well that does make a bit harder.

I'm not being "But they're mine!" about this, that was never why I recorded or shared it.
I know that. I hope you don't think I was implying you were. I just brought it up because if it was through Ebay it might have been grounds to have it terminated. As I'm listening to your recording right now, I can't say how much I appreciate your sharing with the community because there was no way for me to go to one of JC's show. I think these mp3s have really upped the enthusiasm for JC's album for everyone. I'm just so thrilled by how wonderful his new songs are and can't wait for the cd.

From:

I didn't think you were, no, but I'm worried people will think this is some sort of retroactive, "Oh, she's just upset because she wasn't first to realize she could make money off of it." It was for the fandom, everyone in the fandom, and if I have to I'll make it available myself but I'll be damned if someone else tries to make money off of them.

I'm so glad you enjoyed the clips. I'm glad you think they've upped the enthusiasm, because I haven't stopped gushing since the first moment of the first song. Happy to do it.

From:

powrhug.livejournal.com

Babe I saw that and I think from what he said he has the impression that someone else made the clips. I'd email him if you're upset and explain.

From:

I've emailed him and yes, he did credit someone else. However, with a total play time discrepancy of 30 seconds which would be the editing of what talking/whooing there was on the tracks and the obvious lack of A.D.I.D.A.S. plus the quality, I'm sincerely doubting they came from another source.

From:

powrhug.livejournal.com

*nod* I'm just thinking that he was mislead by the person he credited (just because of my dealings with him and how he's been with me). I hope you hear back from him soon with a satisfactory explanation/resolution for you.

From:

coolwhipdiva.livejournal.com

I did e-mail him already, and he said he's talking with the person who made them, so we'll see. But I'm not holding out much hope of the recording being pulled, from the response I got.

From:

http://users.livejournal.com/_carefree/

That sucks that this happened to you! :( Some people are only in things for themselves... I hate that.

From:

This isn't about me, is the thing. I didn't care about where the clips went so long as everyone who wanted them had a chance to have them, and the fact that he's taken it upon himself to take them and turn around to sell them is just wrong.

From:

I had very serious issues when I saw that he had gone on to selling mp3s, which yeah, a lot of the other stuff is just as illegal, but it's not the guy's primary product and it just rubbed me the wrong way. This disc bothers me, but the one of /all/ their music, including album tracks, makes me shake my head and mumble unhappily.

From:

He's selling a CD of all their music? That's. Wow. That's so wrong. I've seen the Longshot DVD which I frowned at, but the rest of it are basically TV appearances, some of which only the ridiculously well-connected people in fandom have so thanks to him for making them available but selling copyrighted material, material on which someone's livelihood depends is something else. I'm just so upset that he'd take this from the public domain, where it belongs, and slap a price tag on it when he's done nothing but take them. If he were doing it at cost, that would be one thing, something I'm prepared to offer to those who can't otherwise get the clips. But he isn't and they're not his to offer, especially not for profit and they were meant for everyone and grr, you know? Grr.

From:

Ahh, you're talking about Bruce. He did the same thing with the bootleg of Justin's detroit club show that was made available a month or two ago on LJ. And I doubt anyone ever got the $200 worth of DVDs that he promised to whoever could provide him with JC or Justin bootlegs. Of course, they are worth much more than $200 to his earnings.

I appreciate that Bruce makes things available to everyone because some of this stuff there is no other way I could get it, but he's not a fan. He's a businessman. And that's fine, but he really crossed the line with the mp3 collection he's selling and the way he's handled these bootlegs. I've actually considered narcing on him to Jive, but then that'll kill all the other stuff he provides too. Still, this is getting a bit much.

I don't know really what to tell you. There's little that you can actually do about it withing dobbing him in, but maybe if we spread the word that the music is available for FREE it'll impact his business. The answer is increasing access not limiting it more because he will still get them. I'm quite sure of that. Fuck, I'd mail people a disc with the music on it for the cost of a stamp and the cd. No one needs to be paying him 10 bucks.

From:

lemniskate.livejournal.com

hey there ;) not stalking you, promise. and I'm not trying to be bruce's big defender, either. The justin club clips that were available on LJ a little bit back came from someone who bought the cd that was offered on ebay---I bought it, and so did someone else. So someone already paid for those--I shared them with bruce because he collects bootlegs, he's a fan, and he does have a lot of non-lj customers.

and the $200 in dvds was for video of the shows, if I recall correctly.

From:

No, actually the Ebay cd came from someone on LJ who bootlegged the show, not the other way around. And I'm pretty sure that Bruce's offer was for both video AND audio. As for the Justin show, she made them available on Ebay so she's kind of shit out of luck. I told her so when she complained about it. But I think this is a little different.

From:

Aside: Bootleg of Justin's Detroit club show? *perks up* I was underage for all that and shall have to look into tracking it down.

Heh, yeah, the $200. What-the fuck-ever. I didn't mention it and he's credited someone named "Lucie on LJ" for the clips so it'd be interesting to know if she got any kind of kickback, but in the e-mail response I got from him, he offered me 10 DVDs of my choice if that would "make me feel better." There are few times in my life I've ever wanted to say "fuck you" to anyone more than him right at that moment.

Of course, they are worth much more than $200 to his earnings.

Right. And see, he really is making a killing on the DVDs, but the prices he charges, especially with the lack of shipping and the sales, aren't nearly outrageous and certainly don't compare to some of the other tape/DVD sellers out there. I agree with you that what he provides for the fandom is for the most great, appearances we couldn't otherwise see unless we were in with a long-time, hardcore archivist. But selling something copyrighted and now something that was distributed freely? I'm a bit livid.

maybe if we spread the word that the music is available for FREE it'll impact his business

That's my idea, too. I'm looking into getting my own webspace and talking to people who've made the clips available until now about posting links to the JJB and other message boards, perhaps even offering to make the CDs at cost myself if people can't download them.

From:

I can get you the bootleg of Justin's detroit show. I'll put it up this weekend.

From:

I'm going to offer the JC show again this weekend once I can get home and check my bandwidth and I would also be happy to help distribute at cost to the folks with dial-up.

I think his offer of 10 DVDs is fucking pathetic. He is going to make a crapload of money off of those CDs. He is a lot cheaper than other bootleggers, but still making a lot of money considering his no frills approach to this business. It probably does not even cost him a dollar to make he's selling for $10 on the audio and a couple of bucks at the most on the DVDs. By the way, keep checking Ebay because he sometimes sells stuff there. They will act on any reports.

From:

Well, I just emailed him regarding my concerns about commercially available product and I await his response. I guess we will just have to see how he handles it. I think if there is enough of a fan reaction, it might have an effect, worth a try at least.

From:

lemniskate.livejournal.com

have you mentioned these misgivings to him? he's really responsive to issues as they're brought up to him, and if he knew this was bothering people, I think he'd respond in a way to keep his customers happy. I commented to embitca's post about the mp3's of the albums too, and in short, I believe he did it for convenience, because he assumes that most people who buy the dvd, or buy any of his stuff are already fans and already own the cds, and he's just saving them the trouble of converting them to mp3.

From:

I just sent an email this morning. Jules' thing made me think about it again and I sent him a note about my misgivings. I've been in the anime fandom for 10 years, so I've had a lot of time to really formulate my opinion on bootlegs and I'm surprisingly lax. But selling album tracks? Just not cool. Doesn't matter if it is the first or the whatever-millionth copy of Celebrity sold, everybody still deserves their percentage. I understand that he thinks he's providing a convenience, I just happen to not agree with it. *grin*

From:

I just emailed him as well.

From:

Rock on. I'm really interested in hearing what he has to say about it. Considering I participate in my fair share of technically illegal activities myself, I'm loathe to report such things to Jive, etc. (Assuming of course that they don't already know about it, heh)

I think for the most part, the material he provides in no way negatively effects NSYNC, in fact, probably the opposite by keeping interest piqued and creating more gung-ho, hardcore fans, but the album tracks just seriously grated on me.

Glad to see someone else actually doing something about it, makes me not feel like such a goody-two-shoes, hall monitor sort. That's not really my bag, *lol*.

From:

I know how you feel. It's really the MP3 collection that bothers me. I have issues over the fandom netiquette of him deciding to sell the JC audio as well, but it's shakier ground. I mentioned both items in my email though.

From:

without-me.livejournal.com

Based on the comments above, I think I've got a fairly good guess who you're talking about. And if I'm right, I wonder if it might be worth going public (on LJ, that is), so people can know what he's doing and--one hopes--refuse to do business with him in the future. I realize his customer base (again, assuming I'm connecting the dots correctly) is wider than just your friends list or mine, but we might make a dent, anyway...

From:

Cooper just mentioned he's selling copyrighted material, which is even more wrong. I mean, most of what he does really is a good service for a lot of fandom who are looking for dated or obscure appearances, and while it's not at cost he does make them very reasonably priced, but some of the things like this that he didn't procure and were meant to be made freely available need to be stopped. I'm trying to figure out how I can definitively, not that I have any doubt right now, that the mp3s are mine without buying a copy, and go from there. I'd be prepared to procure some kind of webspace or offer to burn them to CD myself, at cost. I don't know. I friendslocked this entry, trying to collect my thoughts before going out and out with this, but it's upsetting nonetheless.

From:

tallories.livejournal.com

Wow. I can't believe he's doing that. Well, I guess I can, because he's done everything else, but... wow. Are you sure that they're the same clips?

From:

There's a 30 second time discrepancy, which cuts out what little talking/screaming we left on the tracks, as well as with the notable abscence of A.D.I.D.A.S.? Yeah, I'm more than fairly sure. But I'm trying to figure out a way to know definitively that doesn't involve buying a CD before going entirely public with this.

From: